North Wales Regional Committee

NWRC(2) 01-06

Open Microphone: Questions to the First Minister

1. Introduction

The First Minister, Rhodri Morgan AM, attended the meeting and took part in an Open Microphone session, answering questions from members of the public on issues of particular relevance to North Wales, and questions relating to the National Assembly.

2. Open Microphone: Questions to the First Minister

The Chair welcomed the First Minister Rhodri Morgan AM to the Committee and suggested moving straight to questions.

Vicki Williams from Mold observed the legislation to ban hunting introduced by the government was impractical and asked if this showed that the Labour Government did not understand the problems of rural areas.

The First Minister replied that although he understood strong feelings people held on the issue, it was important to realise that others who disagreed had no less sympathy for the problems of rural areas and the pleasures to be had in rural areas. He stated that the ban is now the law of the land. He added that he personally supported certain kinds of hunting with guns such as the flushing method, to protect lambs from foxes, but he opposed hunting with dogs for leisure purposes.

Jonathan Davies asked what the First Minister’s opinion was in respect of the future for agriculture if the current cheap food policy continued and the single payment scheme deteriorated.

The First Minister replied that there were two aspects:

- the production of higher priced foods with added value for niche and speciality markets selling premium (often locally produced organic) products and

- better stewardship of the land and the evolving of payments for what is not perhaps the highest productivity orientated type of agriculture or land stewardship, involving extensive rather than intensive farming in order to preserve certain types of habitat and to make the environment as attractive as possible.

John Wyn Davies from Ysgol Maes Garmon inquired who would be policing the people walking over private land that was not included in the right to roam land - who would be responsible for ensuring that gates were not left open and that sheep were not attacked by dogs out of control.

The First Minister replied that the early indications were that the problems of this nature were rare under the new CRoW system, although the concerns of farmers were understandable. Sometimes people let their (sometimes unvaccinated) dogs off the leashes unwisely, leaving gates open etc. It was important to educate the public, making them aware of the problems. The new CRoW system ensures that the interest of the farmers, the ramblers and walkers and so far it has worked very well with the odd exception.

Val Walker Jones inquired what funding had been made available to the unitary authorities in Wales to provide pathways for the public to gain easy access to open access land and was it enough.

The First Minister said that he was aware that Eryl Williams had spoken about the partnership in Denbighshire. He stated that having been absent he did not hear what was said about the details of the funding, - whether it was costing more than it had been anticipated. The First Minister promised to give a reply when he had the information from the Welsh Local Government as to whether their Local Government grant funding from the National Assembly was enough.

Mrs. G Lewis asked where the electricity would come from when there was no wind.

The First Minister replied that wind farms were intermittent sources of electricity, their purpose being to avert the use of fossil fuels when the wind was blowing sufficiently strongly for the turbines operate.

Maldwyn Williams inquired when the Assembly would consider the policy of recommending the use of solar panels in all new domestic and commercial industrial buildings with match funding for existing property and whether it was possible to use many rivers and streams in Wales to generate hydro electric energy. She stressed that the question was especially pertinent in conditions when the British natural gas supplies were running out.

The First Minister replied that the Welsh Assembly Government’s policy as laid out in the energy route map was to have a balance of renewables to try to achieve as quickly as possible for at least ten per cent of the electricity to be generated from renewables by 2010. He observed that new technologies always start expensive but when they become more generally used the price decreased. Wind farms on shore had been expensive, but now they are cheap. Offshore wind is expensive, but might become cheap. At the moment, the use of solar panels for domestic purposes was still very expensive.

Prof. Counter from Clawdd Newydd stated that many experts now regarded wind farms as of little value in reducing CO 2 emissions or supporting energy supplies as they needed conventional back up. He asked whether the First Minister recognised that, given that they added nothing to the local economy, their impact on tourism and aspects of opening the countryside should be taken seriously.

The First Minister replied that he agreed only that the problem with the intermittency of wind power supply would arise if the country has massive investment in wind power. In Wales, the level of wind power generation means that the grid can cope with the intermittency of the generation from the wind farms. Wales did not plan to invest in a single renewable technology, but to have a balance between the on/ offshore wind, tidal power as well as the non-renewable technologies such as gas power stations. Also, the development of clean burn coal technology is very important for the preservation of the environment.

Philip Edwards asked if there was a strategy for transport in rural areas and for travel from north to south. He stated that, having listened to the discussion at the Scrutiny of the First Minister meeting on the previous day, he came to the conclusion that there was no such strategy. The Chair suggested to discuss this issue together with the question from Peter Strong from Wrexham Railway Society, who asked whether any progress had been made to improve or create an integrated transport system linking all major towns or cities in Wales, including the establishment of a civilian airport in North Wales and providing concessionary travel for senior citizens linked with joint bus pass.

The First Minister said that, apart from the M4 and A 55 problems, there was also a discussion on how many additional railway stations were needed to open, for example, on the line from Wrexham to Bidston and on the Deeside industrial park. An air service was being established from North Wales to South Wales in autumn 2006 using a civilian section of a military airport. Direct train services were available five times a day. On the question of linking all the major towns in Wales by the direct train services the First Minister stated there were no very large towns or cities. There were only medium size cities like Cardiff and Swansea, medium size towns and small settlements. There was a service between Holyhead and Cardiff five times a day, which the National Assembly subsidises. It is a collector service, collecting passengers from the major and minor towns enroute. The First Minister said that at the moment at least there was no proposals to extend the free bus travel concessionary system for elderly people and disabled people to the train services. He said that these issues would be looked into, but the priority is to try to get service extensions and new stations built.

Laura Smith told of a recent theft from her farm, stating that as the whole police resources were in towns and cities their insurance premium had increased. She asked why there was not more policing rural areas.

The First Minister said it was not practical to put CCTV everywhere across the whole of rural Wales but the police would have to consider the way to adapt to the new situation, when the situation with thefts had improved in urban areas and some crime had moved to rural areas.

Gwilwm Evans, a history and politics teacher in Mold, stated that there was a number of pupils studying the A Level Politics course and part of their work was to study the politics of Wales, Northern Ireland, Scotland, UK political system and the system in the United States. He said that his pupils and he were interested to know whether the First Minister was in favour of the decision to go to war in Iraq.

The First Minister said that he had not had to make that important decision and did not feel it appropriate to offer his personal view.

Another question emphasised the importance of the North Wales Regional Committee meetings for the area, as they helped its social inclusion.

The First Minister agreed that North Wales Regional Committee was the largest and the most popular among the regional committees and that there was a strong case for maintaining it but he stressed that it was a matter for the Assembly take the decision.

The Chair thanked Rhodri Morgan for attending the meeting and taking part in discussion. She closed the meeting by reminding the Members that the next meeting would take place in Criccieth.